Mike Stark from the Daily Kos recently called in to Rush Limbaugh’s radio show, to ask him why modern-day conservatives idolize Reagan. After Stark gave several examples of things that Reagan did that modern-day conservatives would oppose, Limbaugh was at a loss for words as to why Conservatives idolize Reagan.
Transcript;
STARK: Hi, Rush. I, um… I’m calling because… Well, first of all, I’m a liberal, and I seriously don’t understand this, uh, Reagan idolatry on behalf of conservatives. I’ll get… I’ll give you my reasons. Instead of privatizing Social Security, he raised taxes. We’re all paying higher taxes today out of our paychecks every single week because he decided to save Social Security. He –
RUSH: Wait, wait. Hold it. I need to go…
RUSH: Wait. Jeez.
STARK: The Greenspan Commission. He signed it into law, and it raised taxes on Social Security.
RUSH: What…? Wait, you’re talking about Reagan or Clinton?
STARK: I’m talking about Reagan. Reagan did that. He raised taxes on Social Security. He negotiated with terrorists, sending — over and over again — arms to Iran in exchange for hostages perform by contrast Jimmy Carter didn’t give an inch to the Iranians.
RUSH: What in the world…?
STARK: Not an inch. Instead Reagan (crosstalk)
RUSH: Testing the true depth of my politeness here on this call, folks.
STARK: Say that again?
RUSH: Let me ask you a question. What do you think, given all this that you believe, when you hear Obama and the Democrats cite Reagan as they have been doing since about a week before the State of the Union?
STARK: It’s funny you ask that. Because as a liberal I think Obama owes his presidency to Reagan. They’re both kinda stuffed suits that say one thing and then do another. Obama hasn’t been anywhere near liberal enough for me. He said he’d close Guantamano (sic), he hasn’t done that.
RUSH: Yeah.
STARK: He said he’d help people out with foreclosures, he hasn’t done that.
RUSH: I feel for you on that.
STARK: But Reagan, I mean, amnesty to people who are breaking the law and living in the country illegally. He said, “Forget about it. Stay here forever.” He cut and ran from Lebanon. How many hundreds of Marines were killed –
RUSH: Yeah.
STARK: — and he just decided, “Well, you know, instead of the fighting the bad guys I’m gonna run away”?
RUSH: Yeah.
STARK: Why is Reagan a hero to conservatives?
RUSH: ”Why is Reagan a hero to conservatives?” I don’t think you… Given what you’ve said, and I’m not trying to avoid the question, I don’t think you’d ever understand it.
STARK: Well, he’s a tax raiser, an amnesty giver, a cut-and-runner, and he negotiated with terrorists. Why is he a hero to conservatives? I don’t think you understand it.
RUSH: No, I do. Most assuredly I do. I just don’t think that you would understand it. Where did you get this silly notion that Reagan raised taxes on Social Security? What websites do you read? Where did you pick that up?
STARK: Look up the Greenspan Commission. It’s not too hard to find. I mean, it’s a matter of history.
RUSH: Where did you get it? I mean, you’re asking me questions. I’m just reversing one on you here.
STARK: I’m sorry. It’s just general knowledge. It’s something I’ve known for a long time. I can’t remember where I got it from.
RUSH: You can’t remember? You’ve never heard of a website called Media Matters which highlighted it yesterday?
STARK: (static) Oh, no. I know Media Matters very well but that’s not where I got it.
RUSH: Oh, not where you got it. It’s an amazing coincidence.
STARK: (static) I mean, I’m a liberal. Of course I know Media Matters.
RUSH: Amazing coincidence out there.
STARK: They’re a fantastic website. But why are you dodging the question? I want to know why a tax-raising, amnesty-giving, cut-and-running, negotiating-with-terrorists guy is a hero to the conservative movement.
RUSH: Well, because you understand Reagan in a way that is flawed. You –
Your call is actually kinda interesting because you represent the impossibility of “bridging the gap.” Somebody like you just has to be defeated. There’s no crossing the aisle and finding common ground with you. You’re free to be who you are, don’t misunderstand. I’m not trying to insulting. I’m just saying, you are unreachable. You don’t want to be reached. T his picture of Reagan, you’ve just described somebody you should love, and you hate him! You just described somebody you should absolutely love, all these things. He’s an anti-conservative, as you say, but you don’t love him. You’re having trouble understanding why he’s viewed as heroic to a lot of people.
I could talk to you about anti-communism. I could. You want to talk about amnesty? Yeah, that was Simpson-Mazzoli, and that was one-and-a-half, two million illegals; and he was told, “Okay, if we’re gonna do this, this is it, then. We’re gonna secure the borders and that’s it.” It’s the same thing with every tax increase he signed. It was also accompanied by promises to cut spending, and it never happened. Reagan’s not perfect. Nobody is. But I think the proof of Reagan is the fact that when your guys get in trouble, who do they seek to associate themselves with? Remember, Obama and these people are all about getting votes.
The fact that he’s trying to surround himself with Reagan, the fact that he’s trying to position himself with Reagan is the best indication anybody could have of what this country really thinks of Ronaldus Magnus. I think if you want to focus in on hypocrisy, you’ve got far more of it on your side of the aisle to explain and dig through than we do. Reagan was forced to raise payroll taxes by a crisis in Social Security in 1983. He endorsed that rescue plan that was written by Alan Greenspan. It was reluctant. He was not a big supporter of that. Remember, Reagan did not have a congressional majority with him.
Everything he got, the tax cuts, he had Democrats outnumbering him in the House and Senate everywhere. There were certain realities that he faced. But the biggest tax increase on Social Security was authored by none other than Bill Clinton. But did you understand the notion? Ronald Reagan fought for America. He loved America. He feared where the left, based on history, wanted to take the country. Ronald Reagan set the stage for the end of the Cold War. Ronald Reagan defeated Soviet communism without firing a shot. I don’t know… But none of that would matter. So you, sir, a nice individual, I’m sure you’re a fine guy (probably not too much fun at a ball game, unlike Bill Clinton), but still, you illustrate that people like you just have to be defeated, not met halfway and gotten along with. I mean politically.
So typical of left/right debate. Each side says the other is 100% full of crap. They read/hear the exact same thing, but respond totally differently. Neither side is completely full of crap, but both sides are partially full of it. Truth is, Ronald Reagan did indeed do many things conservatives do not agree with. But he was the best at creating an image. He was an actor for goodness sakes. He came across like the world’s most lovable grandpa. Unfortunately, only the image he wanted is remembered by most people, especially conservatives. Hius biggest accomplishment of course was winning the cold War. Or at least that’s the conventional wisdom. For many people, that alone is enough. Problem is, it’s not 100% true. The Soviets did a good job of defeating themselves due to decades of gross financial mismanagement. They then got mired in Afghanistan which really wrecked their economy. Reagan contributed to their economic woes by competing with them to spend lots of money building nukes. Other than that, he didn’t really have that much to do with the collapse of the Soviet Union. He was lucky in timing. But of course most Americans want to believe it was all because of RR. Americans believe a lot of myths. RR did a lot of TALKING about shrinking government, but the reality is he increased it. RR did a lot of talking about being tough and not negotiating with terrorists, but he in fact did. People tend to remember what he said, not what he did.
Most of the things he did that the caller emphasized are little known facts. They are facts, but not what has been sired into people’s minds. Ronald Reagan was the ultimate triumph of style over substance. People idolize a myth. A character.
He did fine answering the question… but once the Left embraces some fabricated narrative, in this case, one that Reagan was some secret Lib hero, they can’t help but run with it.
Seriously, the Kos caller lost it the second he tried to portray Reagan as to the left of Carter.
The caller did not say RR was to the left of Jimmy Carter. He said RR negotiated with terrorists and JC did not. That is a true fact whether you believe it or not.
There is nothing “leftist” about what Ronald Reagan did…he was heinous and corrupt and, frankly, bone ignorant. Which begs the question: why do conservatives idolize such an ignorant, corrupt and heinous individual?
Not surprising, this is exactly how Limbaugh deals with anyone who calls into his show with legitimate questions. If they aren’t blind, conservative lemmings, he can’t hold his own or respond intelligently with factual information. He’s a joke.
All the second paragraph in Rush’s speech does is make Reagan look like:
A: a political equivalent to a drug addict (“OK, this is the last time, one last hit then I’m done)
B: a liar who goes back on his promises
C: a puppet, being controlled by other people
D: all the above
Take your pick.
NOTE: this is what a Conservitive formal education has done to me… I even talk in multiple choice format.
@Larry: To be fair to Stark, I get the distinct impression that when Rush got into his little tirade, Stark’s phone line was cut off. After all, a rebuttal during all of that rhetoric would’ve made ol’ Rush look like a bigger tool than he is.
This is further proof of exactly how all conservatives these days, including self-serving pundits like our dear friends Rush and Glenn, try to deal with any question they don’t have a ready-made, carefully rehearsed answer for. Run their mouths with endless diatribe and remove whoever is asking the question in the process so that when they’re through, it almost seems like whoever was asking in the first place was somehow satisfied with the endless nonsense.
I love how Rush squirmed and resorted to declaring that someone who was asking a relatively simple question about their Great Teacher and the fallacy of worshipping him simply “needed to be defeated.” No attempt to genuinely answer the question, just “Your view is flawed and you need to be defeated.” Typical conservative BS.
Makes for entertaining radio, though. It’s nice to see how furiously these guys squirm when their little fantasy bubble is penetrated by a healthy dose of reality.
To Mike Stark: I doubt you’re reading this, although it would be cool if you did. Good job putting Rush on the spot. Next time, mention that Reagan’s most trusted advisor was his astrologer. Not only is it guaranteed to launch any conservative who hears it into a tirade, but it’s further proof of Reagan being distinctly liberal by modern conservatism’s view. (“OMG, the inclusion of something religious that ISN’T JEEBUS?! *froth*”)
Reagan “fought for this country.???” Certainly not in the military. I think Mr. Limpball was thinking of John Kerry, or Al Gore, or John McCain, or G.H.W. Bush, or John Kennedy.
Mr. Limpball has never been known as a skilled debater–that’s why, on this rare occasion of taking a call from a lefty, he evades, insults, attacks, and tells the caller that he “must be defeated” without ever explaining why.
All of you liberal Reagan and Limbaugh haters only heard what you wanted to hear. After being presented with a question with many false and/or misleading premises, it took him a minute to do a little research, but once he looked up the bogus claim, he answered the Social Security question quite well at the end of the segment. It was a bipartisan comission and a compromise bill that, was ment to save Social Security. It also included many conservative changes to SS that Reagan wanted. Limbaugh was also right when he said the extreme left is incapable of compromise, neither is the extreme right. How sad and narrow minded.
Talk about dodging the question! I have never heard Rush answer a question without making it a Martin Luther speech type…He spouts off politically and ralleys the troops by saying Reagan Loved this country…etc. He’s all fluff and no substance. He makes 100′s of millions a year keeping the right Dumbed down! They eat this sort of talk up. He is what I call, a media clown!
Simply look at the last paragraph of Rush’s answer. The reasons are CLEARLY stated.
Well,I really didn’t expect a straight answer from him of all people, giving that he is a drug addict,a drug felon,Oh yeah a fatt arse for whom 44 Days in the Army During The Vietnam War was quite enough(Doctors Note Ya`ll)HIPPO-CRATE .That is what is so love able about ole` Lard. Regan practically made drug laws Tailored for guy`s just like him.The only Personal Liberties they are concerned about are second amendment,oh yeah and fetuses.
This conversation can be taken two ways. To Rush’s supporters, it would seem to me. it sounded like Rush stood up to Stark and gave him all the reasons Reagan did what he did. I would have liked to have heard Stark repeatedly ask the initial question, why do conservatives idolize Reagan. Reagan would not be welcome in today’s Republican Party, certainly not in the Tea Party. Rush seems to have answered the question (although he really didn’t) and bashed Stark in the process and Stark didn’t respond.
Rush is such a blowhard
This was a fine start, but doesn’t come close to capturing the hypocrisy that is the current Republican Reagan Re-creation of Reality. He bloated and increased the government; his economic policies morphed the deficit from manageable to “OMG” status; and actually worked with Tip O’Neill (gasp!) in a bipartisan manner. By current definitions, he was not a conservative Republican, but rather a liberal Democrat. As a liberal Democrat I know he was far, far from that, but he was not the man the GOP claims he was. They keep drinking the Kool-Aid thinking it’s a fine wine, and telling the rest of us to have another glass. No thanks…I didn’t ask for the first glass; sure do not need more…
Wow, it is almost painful listening to Limbaugh scramble to try and think of how to respond to the FACTS that were presented to him. “You’re unreachable, I can’t explain it to you”, “Regan didn’t support the actions the took”, “He defeated Communism by negotiating with them” (which is something the liberals advocated for).
To quote Trapper John from MASH, “My question is, why won’t you answer his question.”
I imagine the call screener got his as handed to him during the commercial break.
i love when radio pundits realize that they have get out of a call they can not win and do ridiculous tricks like playing a static track over a caller’s audio. that way they can play it off as if they got rid of the caller because of a weak reception.
[[Fluff,fluff]] Okay Rush, now let’s get back to the question…
He avoided the question with rhetoric upon rhetoric, but that is how he has made his money, he never answers question, he loves to answer a question with another question. Back in the day when I was in school, and also I was a teacher, I was instructed to answer a question, point blank. If I needed to ask another question, I could do so, but an answer was necessary.
Yes, Obama has not been liberal enough for me, but he has done great things for this country, considering the mess he was given on Inauguration Day!
WOW I homeschool my kids and we have been working through a book called “The Fallacy Detective”. Obviously it discusses how to detect fallacies in a conversation/debate. Thank Mr. Limbaugh for offering this perfect example from which my kids will learn.
Wow. All that bloviation, and he didn’t even come CLOSE to answering the question.